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 An image submitted to Senior Editor and Founder of Thomas Paine's Corner Jason Miller by an anonymous source in which Miller said he was told it was a carcass of a horse. The photo was said to have been taken on June 28. [Click to enlarge] |
Following an investigation by the Bourbon County Sheriff Ron Gray and the Kansas State Veterinarian Paul Grosdidier, the allegations of starvation and neglect made by Senior Editor and Founder of Thomas Paine's Corner Jason Miller against local horse trader Raymond Tucker of Tucker Brothers, LLC, were unfounded. In a statement released by Grosdidier he said there was, "no basis for the complaint of neglect and starvation of horses and that Tucker Brothers, LLC is operating within guidelines of Kansas State Law regarding its care and treatment of horses."
Tucker and Miller met the evening of July 2 to view the farm which Tucker keeps his horses. Both men said the meeting was friendly.
"Despite our polar opposite world views ... we got along fine," Miller said.
 An image taken by Tribune Reporter Michael Pommier on July 2 showing the same object in the same location. [Click to enlarge] |
"Neither Ray nor I displayed the antipathy that we naturally feel toward one another (him for a bunny hugging do-gooder and me for an animal exploiting redneck), which was good in that it enabled both of us to achieve our goals. Tucker got to execute his dog and pony show to near perfection, almost convincing me that he is a decent horse lover who performs an essential 'service' to the horse population at large. And I got to gather the information I sought," Miller said on his website, www.thomaspainescorner.wordpress.com.
Miller told the Tribune, "That was a conclusion I drew after the fact... I went into it with as open mind as I could based on my phone conversation with him."
Miller said that what he saw at the farm was in contrast to what he saw in the photos submitted to him anonymous source. One specific instance he mentioned in his follow-up blog was that it appeared Tucker had "whisked away" 60 horsed to El Paso, Texas, the night before their meeting.
 A closer image taken by Tribune Reporter Michael Pommier which shows the alleged carcass to be a broken up log. [Click to enlarge] |
When asked to confirm the conversation, Miller responded, "I can't answer that truthfully because I don't remember."
Another allegation Miller made in his follow-up blog was that "several people who are versed in equine care" advised him that Tucker was not providing sufficient care to starving horses by letting them roam his pastures.
"We consider that to be a violation ... certainly morally problematic and certainly legally problematic because he is not providing adequate care for those horses," Miller said.
The biggest allegation made on the blog was that Tucker's wife, Diann, said they had turned down offers from rescue organizations without any financial gain.
"He never spoke anything to me and I never made that statement," Diann said.
Tucker said that he has sold horses to a rescue organization in Missouri in the past and that he has been on the phone with other agencies on the east coast. Tucker added that he would be willing to give away the horses which he did not buy and charge only to transport them. The also said that he would be willing to sell the horses he bought for a "reasonable price or market price."
"As long as my expense is covered ... I don't have any problem letting an adoption agency coming in," Tucker said.
Miller added, "It appears that he is very sincere in wanting to bring in rescue people to start buying the horses. If we can achieve that, we'll be happy."
Miller did admit that despite his allegations posted on his website, he did not personally witness any mistreatment of the horses and that his options were based one what appeared to be starvation and the things that his anonymous "horse experts" had told him.
"I don't know whether or not [the horses] were [thin] when they came to him, they very well could have been," Miller said. "Our position is ... that even if they were that way when he get them then he has an obligation as the owner ... to give it proper medical care."
Miller posted on his follow-up blog, "As one of my anonymous sources (the one who took the pictures you are viewing) noted, photos don't lie." However in the photos on the front page of today's edition of The Tribune tell a different story. A photo posted on Miller's original blog was believed to have been the carcass of a horse. When informed by a Tribune reporter that it was not a carcass, but that it was a log, Miller posted the update to the original post, "There is some controversy associated with the above photo. Some claim it is the remains of a horse corpse. Others assert it is a rotting tree. The photo was taken by an anonymous source on Tucker's property."
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I do not think an investigation is valid by a local sheriff who is probably good friends of the alleged abuser....
there needs to be a seperate investigation by someone who is not from the area and did not grow up with Raymond Tucker!!
I DON'T UNDERSTAND,IF AN ALLEGATION OF ABUSE HAS BEEN REPORTED, WHY WAS THE ALLEGED ABUSER TOLD WHEN THE INSPECTION WAS GOING TO TAKE PLACE. I ALSO AGREE WITH BARBEDWIRE, LOCAL AUTHORITY SHOULD NOT HAVE HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH IT. IF THIS IS ONE OF THOSE SITUATIONS THAT THE TRUTH WILL NEVER BE KNOWN, REST ASSURED, GOD KNOWS!!!!!!!! I FIRMLY BELEIVE THERE IS A SPECIAL PLACE IN HELL FOR THOSE THAT ABUSE ANIMALS!!!!!!!!!!!
UMMMMM....excuse me barbwired and 3dn74...in case you missed it I have copied it for you...."Following an investigation by the Bourbon County Sheriff Ron Gray and the Kansas State Veterinarian Paul Grosdidier"
Did you notice that the KANSAS STATE VETERINARIAN also inspected the premises. WHAT???? is this not qualified and independent enough for you?????
Last time I checked this man does not live in Bourbon county....................
Wow I am shocked I have the original picture of the dead horse and I can't believed some one is trying to pass this off as the real picture looks nothing like it.I know that the sheriff's office in Bourbon County has been investigating these allegations since early June.They neglected to tell you that the Veterinarian they used originally to investigate these horses was the same Veterinarian that is use by Tucker himself.I have been watching these horses on a regular basis since the beginning of June.These horses showed little if no improvement over the month he had them until he shipped them off. With some medical care (de-wormer) they would of showed improvement in this pasture full of grass. Food or lack of it is not the problem, lack of proper medical care is! Most of these horses are conveniently gone now. Their is little evidence left. Kansas State Veterinarian Paul Grosdidier wasn't brought in before most were shiped off. I would of liked to see him be able to check them out before they had been shipped off.I am sadden by the cover up that has obviously taken place here. I have been out to check on these horses daily and know these things as fact from a first hand account.These horses are far beyond saving now. I would just like to see it not happen in the future. I believe people deserve to know the truth.
Please look up slaughter process in Canada and Mexico. If this is something you support then you are pro-slaughter. After reading this I would say the Fort Scott Tribune is big fan of stabbing horses to paraylize then hanging them to bleed while still alive. THis is what this man is driving these horses down to to their death and fate. Lets not even get into the process of long drive with no food or water or the two day old colt put on truck that was trampled. THere are laws and regulations when you are feed lot. People look it up on live stock statues in KS. before you write out a plea to support and protect person that from what I read gelding with no vet, sick horses left to to die no vetting again. Why should he? They just go to slaughter anyway is his state of mind. Laws are being broken I can see that in the pictures alone.
by the way I seen other pictures on this story of actual horses how about showing the whole story instead of having fun with the tree pictures. Just do your job! be a journallist not a bias local.
Are any of you people here that are complaining about the alleged abuse willing to be physically and financial involved long term to support and care for these allegedly abused animals?
no one puts gun to his head and makes him drive to auctions and buy up horses.
How much did Tucker and the rest of the Good Old Boys pay you to run this blatantly biased article. Conklin Dairy Farms here we go again.
SURE LIGHTING, I WOULD BE WILLING TO SPEND THE MONEY TO CARE FOR THOSE HORSES BUT I AM NOT WILLING TO PUT IN TUCKERS POCKET! I WOULDN'T WANT IT TO GO TOWARDS MORE HORSES BOUGHT FOR PROFIT OR SLAUGHTER. EITHER WAY I SEE NO COMPASSION FROM HIM FOR HIS HORSES BY WORDS OR BY WHAT I HAVE SEEN. I DON'T THINK SOMEONE THAT THINKS SO LITTLE OF AN ANIMAL SHOULD OWN ONE OR BUY ONE FOR ANY REASON.
Chiripada, if you're so willing to save these horses then it shouldn't really make any difference who's pocket the money goes in.
PS
Drop the Caps Lock.
Please know that first and foremost I am OUTRAGED by the animal abuse and neglect sited in this article and others regarding Tucker Brothers, LLC.
Believe me when I say the Cover Up is a VERY close second. By local law enforcement, medical provider(veterinary), and journalist influence. This is just another example of what this world is coming to. Those who are defending or protecting Tucker are condoning the abuse, neglect, and mistreatment of these animals by hiding and denying the truth. If they are willing to do this for this scum imagine what they will cover up that may actually mean something to you one day CountryGal and Lightning... These people are bound by oaths and codes of ethics...
Law Enforcement(by the Bourbon County Sheriff Ron Gray)...please see the law enforcement oath here (http://www.theiacp.org/PoliceServices/ExecutiveServices/ProfessionalAssistance/Ethics/WhatistheLawEnforcementOathofHonor/tabid/150/Default.aspx).
The veterinarian (by Kansas State Veterinarian Paul Grosdidie) ...please see the veterinarian oath here(http://netvet.wustl.edu/vetoath.htm).
Or the media, who are not actually sworn by an oath, however, they do have a code of conduct...please find here (http://www.rs.org/journalism.htm).
Wake up...open your eyes and know we are set on this Earth to protect the weak and vulnerable...animals, children, elderly, disabled, etc... Those who do not show compassion or kindness to those dependent on us are the worst kind of criminals and should be removed from our society as they are a cancer!
More ugly "Good Ol Boy" politics in Kansas to protect animal abusers and exploiters. Really, unacceptable answers that have been provided by the locals. I am certain that some here do not understand that you cannot pull these stunts and think that the allegations will go away. We are watching and will not be intimidated by these very outdated tactics..you may be a big fish in a small pond, but reality is you are in a fishbowl.
Why can't we all just get along and find a way to achieve peace in the world of mankind?
The TPC troll's have arrived in Bourbon Co.
Don't feed the Troll's.
First of all those photos at first glance could be mistaken as logs but anyone who knows horses can clearly see the outline and bones. The color difference between the rotting wood and the horse carcass are plain to see as well. I saw the original photos of the sick and abused horses already and there is no way of taken those images back. As far as using investigators and a VET from the same area in which this man Tucker does business with is just another Conklin happening all over again. Where I come from we call this the "Good Ole Boys Club" as some have already mentioned here. You can bet that all involved are on Tuckers payroll in some way. Small town politics and no justice. Why aren't investigators used from other areas? What about the state laws pertaining to animal abuse and neglect?
It sounds like "Country Gal" lives in that area and who knows, may be dating one of Tuckers family members. What you said means absolutely nothing at all.
Yes, you bet "Lightening" we would be willing to take these abused and neglected animals away from their hell! How about you?
Well said HWolf!!!!! I couldn't have said it better myself! Some people need to be hit in the head with a 2x4 to get the message. Thank you!
"WhatSay?", in a perfect world this would be wonderful but this is reality. Until then we are in a war to stop our animals from becoming the whipping posts of greedy mankind. There is no peaceful way of settling such a war until the users and abusers concede and understand that our animals are NOT our property to maim, use, abuse and murder!
You're right "Lightening" do not feed the trolls so may I suggest you find another place to slither around instead of wasting our time and energy. It is obvious you are as ignorant and as disrespectful as those who are committing these crimes themselves. Leave the important work to those who really do care and know what they are talking about.
This WILL stop no matter how long it takes. We WILL win! WE WILL NOT GO AWAY!!!
Rhiannon
First of all those photos at first glance could be mistaken as logs but anyone who knows horses can clearly see the outline and bones. The color difference between the rotting wood and the horse carcass are plain to see as well. I saw the original photos of the sick and abused horses already and there is no way of taken those images back. As far as using investigators and a VET from the same area in which this man Tucker does business with is just another Conklin happening all over again. Where I come from we call this the "Good Ole Boys Club" as some have already mentioned here. You can bet that all involved are on Tuckers payroll in some way. Small town politics and no justice. Why aren't investigators used from other areas? What about the state laws pertaining to animal abuse and neglect?
It sounds like "Country Gal" lives in that area and who knows, may be dating one of Tuckers family members. What you said means absolutely nothing at all.
Yes, you bet "Lightening" we would be willing to take these abused and neglected animals away from their hell! How about you?
Well said HWolf!!!!! I couldn't have said it better myself! Some people need to be hit in the head with a 2x4 to get the message. Thank you!
"WhatSay?", in a perfect world this would be wonderful but this is reality. Until then we are in a war to stop our animals from becoming the whipping posts of greedy mankind. There is no peaceful way of settling such a war until the users and abusers concede and understand that our animals are NOT our property to maim, use, abuse and murder!
You're right "Lightening" do not feed the trolls so may I suggest you find another place to slither around instead of wasting our time and energy. It is obvious you are as ignorant and as disrespectful as those who are committing these crimes themselves. Leave the important work to those who really do care and know what they are talking about.
This WILL stop no matter how long it takes. We WILL win! WE WILL NOT GO AWAY!!!
Rhiannon
you got that right Lightning!
Millers little entourage of trolls have arrived.
What's ridiculous is they think that 6 or 8 people calling,writing letters, etc can ultimately stop what they describe as animal exploitation that is occurring in a country of over 300 million meat eaters that ate 28 BILLION pounds of processed cow meat last year, not to mention the billions of pounds of chicken,pigs,goats,sheep,ducks,geese,rabbits,deer,eggs and milk. That's gotta be in the hundreds of millions of animals killed and eaten each year!!
Face it people, it's not just me, we are a whole nation of animal killing, meat eating, top of the food chain humans, and we like it! !
First of all those photos at first glance could be mistaken as logs but anyone who knows horses can clearly see the outline and bones. The color difference between the rotting wood and the horse carcass are plain to see as well. I saw the original photos of the sick and abused horses already and there is no way of taken those images back. As far as using investigators and a VET from the same area in which this man Tucker does business with is just another Conklin happening all over again. Where I come from we call this the "Good Ole Boys Club" as some have already mentioned here. You can bet that all involved are on Tuckers payroll in some way. Small town politics and no justice. Why aren't investigators used from other areas? What about the state laws pertaining to animal abuse and neglect?
It sounds like "Country Gal" lives in that area and who knows, may be dating one of Tuckers family members. What you said means absolutely nothing at all.
Yes, you bet "Lightening" we would be willing to take these abused and neglected animals away from their hell! How about you?
Well said HWolf!!!!! I couldn't have said it better myself! Some people need to be hit in the head with a 2x4 to get the message. Thank you!
"WhatSay?", in a perfect world this would be wonderful but this is reality. Until then we are in a war to stop our animals from becoming the whipping posts of greedy mankind. There is no peaceful way of settling such a war until the users and abusers concede and understand that our animals are NOT our property to maim, use, abuse and murder!
You're right "Lightening" do not feed the trolls so may I suggest you find another place to slither around instead of wasting our time and energy. It is obvious you are as ignorant and as disrespectful as those who are committing these crimes themselves. Leave the important work to those who really do care and know what they are talking about.
This WILL stop no matter how long it takes. We WILL win! WE WILL NOT GO AWAY!!!
Rhiannon
I am not, but might date one of the Tucker boys.
I like cowboys!
are there any in their twenties?
First of all those photos at first glance could be mistaken as logs but anyone who knows horses can clearly see the outline and bones. The color difference between the rotting wood and the horse carcass are plain to see as well. I saw the original photos of the sick and abused horses already and there is no way of taken those images back. As far as using investigators and a VET from the same area in which this man Tucker does business with is just another Conklin happening all over again. Where I come from we call this the "Good Ole Boys Club" as some have already mentioned here. You can bet that all involved are on Tuckers payroll in some way. Small town politics and no justice. Why aren't investigators used from other areas? What about the state laws pertaining to animal abuse and neglect?
It sounds like "Country Gal" lives in that area and who knows, may be dating one of Tuckers family members. What you said means absolutely nothing at all.
Yes, you bet "Lightening" we would be willing to take these abused and neglected animals away from their hell! How about you?
Well said HWolf!!!!! I couldn't have said it better myself! Some people need to be hit in the head with a 2x4 to get the message. Thank you!
"WhatSay?", in a perfect world this would be wonderful but this is reality. Until then we are in a war to stop our animals from becoming the whipping posts of greedy mankind. There is no peaceful way of settling such a war until the users and abusers concede and understand that our animals are NOT our property to maim, use, abuse and murder!
You're right "Lightening" do not feed the trolls so may I suggest you find another place to slither around instead of wasting our time and energy. It is obvious you are as ignorant and as disrespectful as those who are committing these crimes themselves. Leave the important work to those who really do care and know what they are talking about.
This WILL stop no matter how long it takes. We WILL win! WE WILL NOT GO AWAY!!!
Rhiannon
Rhiannon,
when you are old and lonely and in a nursing home you will look back on your efforts and see that you really didn't change anything much at all. Especially when you see the meat on the menu there.
I am sorry about the duplication of my messages. This was not meant to happen.
I am sorry "Country Gal" I will not respond to an ignorant twenty something immature rambling with little to say but gibberish. I will save my efforts on those who are mature and intelligent enough to take on such important issues. Thank you.
poor Country Gal, suffered frontal lobe damage on the way down the birth canal...
Oh and by the way "Country Gal" there are more than just a few of us. WE ARE MILLIONS AND HAVE MADE A HUGE DIFFERENCE IN THIS AREA. DO YOUR RESEARCH AND WHO KNOWS, MAYBE YOU WILL COME TO UNDERSTAND THE TRUE MEANING BEHIND WHAT AND WHY WE DO WHAT WE DO. Thank you.
You just think you are in the millions. I've seen the pictures(and remember, pictures don't lie do they) of your protests in Kansas city, and seen you in action downtown. Ha, more like 6 people............
Millions are numbers that are probably beyond your ability to comprehend. Millions are numbers represented by such examples as this; 47,000,000 people eat meat at McDonalds restaurants in America each and every day of the year.
300,000,000 people in America eat meat.
Over 40,000,000 pounds of horsemeat is eaten by humans every year. That's millions.
On a world scale it gets into the billions of people and trillions of animals killed and eaten, but why am I trying to explain this to someone who thinks 6 is millions?
We can judge the heart of a man by his treatment of animals. - Immanuel Kant
A horse doesn't care how much you know until he knows how much you care. - Pat Parelli
Bread may feed my body, but my horse feeds my soul.
Give a horse what he needs and he will give you his heart in return.
Give me food and drink; and care for me. And when the day's work is done, shelter me. Give me a clean bed and leave me not too small a place in the stable. Talk to me, for your voice often takes the place of reins. Be good to me and I shall serve you more gladly and love you.
Horses... if God made anything more beautiful, he kept it for himself.
Horses are the dolphins of the plains, the spirits of the wind; yet we sit astride them for the sake of being well-groomed, whereas they could have all the desire in the world to bolt, but instead, they adjust their speed and grace, only to please us, never to displease.
- Lauren Salerno
Horses give us the wings we lack.
I have seen things so beautiful, that they have brought tears to my eyes. Yet, none of them can match the gracefulness and beauty of a horse running free.
I have often been asked why do I like horses so much. Look into one's eyes. There you will see generations of horses who have served the humans for thousands of years faithfully for nothing in return. Beaten horses, starved hoses, horses who no longer possess a spirit. They deserve to be loved and respected as much as humanly possible. Let them run free again. Let them no longer be a faithful beasts, but embrace them as you would a dear friend, for that is what they are.
Nothing is more sacred as the bond between a horse and his friend. No other creature can ever become so emotionally close to a human as a horse. When a horse dies, the memory lives on, because an enormous part of his owner's heart, soul, and the very existence dies also.
Our perfect companions never have fewer than four feet.
To understand the soul of a horse is the closest we humans can come to knowing perfection.
Throw your heart over a fence and your horse will follow.
When your horse follows you without being asked, when he rubs his head on yours, and when you look at him and feel a tingle down your spine you, know you are loved. Do you love him back?
Grow up little girl and do your research, not on how many animals you and your kind murder but on the movement and its associations as well. You had better take out your calculator kiddo.
Isn't it past your bed time Country Gal? Go rest your brain and let those who know what they are doing handle this. You may way want to go flirting on My Space. You have no business here.
Rhiannon, you said on Fri,Jul9,2010 at 1032pm the following,""WhatSay?", in a perfect world this would be wonderful but this is reality. Until then we are in a war to stop our animals from becoming the whipping posts of greedy mankind. There is no peaceful way of settling such a war until the users and abusers concede and understand that our animals are NOT our property to maim, use, abuse and murder!"
I think the law may be interested in this comment, as it appears to be a terroristic threat.
Note the,"there is no peaceful way of settling such a war" comment.
I believe the FBI may be interested in these posts so I will gladly forward them right away.
Jason, we are all one, and we are many! They cannot and will not beat us. You are the best! These people try and belittle you and the movement, why? because we are a huge threat to them. We have numerous victories under our belts. they know this and are threatened of our strong wills and never ending determination. They harass us in hopes we will give up and turn away. If they think this will happen they sure don't know us very well do they. We will keep fighting until we win this next victory. WE ARE HERE TO STAY!
Please do little girl lol. They know this is not a threat and never has been. Get your sleep sweetheart before your brain explodes. Good grief. We get all kinds here dont we. Go for it little girl. I know what the FBI is looking for and there is no way they are going to harass non terrorists. If you think signing petitions, rallying and sending letters is terrorism you need a bit more education. No where did I threaten anyone or anything. Get a grip and go to where the little kids play.
Animal Enterprise Protection Act of 1992.
Public Law 102-346--Aug. 26, 1992
102nd Congress
An Act To protect animal enterprises.
Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled,
SECTION 1. SHORT TITLE.
This Act may be cited as the "Animal Enterprise Protection Act of 1992".
SEC. 2. ANIMAL ENTERPRISE TERRORISM.
(a) IN GENERAL.--Title 18, United States Code, is amended by inserting after section 42 the following:
"§ 43. Animal enterprise terrorism
"(a) OFFENSE.--Whoever--
"(1) travels in interstate or foreign commerce, or uses or causes to be used the mail or any facility in interstate or foreign commerce, for the purpose of causing physical disruption to the functioning of an animal enterprise; and
"(2) intentionally causes physical disruption to the functioning of an animal enterprise by intentionally stealing, damaging, or causing the loss of, any property (including animals or records) used by the animal enterprise, and thereby causes economic damage exceeding $10,000 to that enterprise, or conspires to do so; shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one year, or both.
AND AGAIN!!!!! None of this has been done. Go ahead kid and make a fool of yourself.
A terroristic threat is a crime generally involving A THREAT TO COMMIT VIOLENCE COMMUNICATED WITH THE INTENT TO TERRORIZE ANOTHER, to cause evacuation of a building, or to cause serious public inconvenience, in reckless disregard of the risk of causing such terror or inconvenience. It may mean an offense against property or involving danger to another person that may include but is not limited to recklessly endangering another person, harassment, stalking, ethnic intimidation, and criminal mischief.
None of this has been done here or ever will be done. WE are well aware of the laws and are not stupid enough to put ourselves in this situation. We do not work this way. Get a grip and go away.
Oh and by the way, when we protest we get a permit issued by law enforcement. Nite nite
Oh and another thing. This is a public forum. We are just answering questions and replying. This is not a threatening atmosphere and the only one who is doing the harassing seems to be you. There is no talk of hurting or harassing anyone on our part. We are angry and are speaking our minds. Go to bed before I call your momma
Read the 1st offense listed in the animal enterprise protection act. (1)) travels in interstate or foreign commerce, or uses or causes to be used the mail or any facility in interstate or foreign commerce, for the purpose of causing physical disruption to the functioning of an animal enterprise.
I think the FBI may see it differently. To me it appears you and others may have crossed the line and attempted to cause physical disruption of the operations at the Tucker farm, by using false photo's, the local newspaper and your website as the facility for implementing this plan.
This and your warlike, terroristic comments may be pretty intimidating to them.
sleep well, the FBI WILL be notified!
Sorry, does not fit either and they would know that. They just dont go off half cocked. They know everything that is going on and are focused on those who hurt others and damage property. The true meaning of terrorism. Tell them I said hello. I will tell you though, you had better have some concrete evidence or you will be sued by me for slander and defamation of character as well as harassment.
As a matter of fact I think I will also contact the others you have threatened here and see what they have to say. Go tell it on the mountain!
All your threats have been copied. We will see what transpires. We will leave it all up to the FBI to decide. Later kiddo. Get a grip.
well, If you can ask the sheriff, the state dept of agriculture, the city attorney and others to investigate allegations of animal cruelty, by that same right I can ask the FBI and state law enforcement to investigate this line of messages!
I have my copies too.
Rhiannon, remember when you said in an earlier comment,"Well said HWolf!!!!! I couldn't have said it better myself! Some people need to be hit in the head with a 2x4 to get the message. Thank you!"
Wow, that sounded pretty violent!
Oh good grief! Thats only a figure of speech. If the FBI looks at my page they will see a very non violent person. Give me a break.
You know Country Girl, when a person loves animals they take care of them and love them. I am horrified at what I have seen happening everywhere. No we cannot stop it all but we have made great strides in dealing with the representatives and senate on a mature and amicable level. We never terrorized anyone when we talked with the senators from Missouri to spare the horses from being sold to Japan for consumption. They agreed and changed the bill. No threats, no harassment, just education. Look, I know there are millions that eat meat and millions more who couldnt care less how an animal is treated. I do care and it makes me ill and really upset to see this happen. I do not hurt anyone or anything and neither do my animal loving friends. We do all we can to help the animals and educate others on the humane treatment of them. Take a walk around FB sometime and check out all the pro kill animal groups with their photos of cats and dogs heads impaled on a stick, cats with their stomachs cut in two, women crushing kittens and puppies slowly with their heels. That is terrorism!
I guess if you loved animals the way me and many others do you would be pissed off at their treatment as well. Although there are some few and far between farms who actually are humane to their animals there are so many who are not. They are thought of as property and treated as such. You can take everything I said and call me a terrorist if you'd like but the true terrorists are out there torturing critters for amusement and hatred just as I mentioned in the groups on FB. It is not a pretty sight so be aware of the graphic images before you go in. I have nothing more to say. This whole situation with animal abuse has worn me out and made me ill. Do what you feel you need to do but remember who the real terrorists are. R
The Tucker case is only one in a LONG list of cover ups where horses and other animals are abused. Vets and other officials that are supposed to be protecting these animals are involved in the corruption all the time, in every state, in every country. I watched horses in the exact same situation as the poor horses at the Tucker place. The humane officer (joke) that didn't have any knowledge of horses assisted in the abuse by doing nothing. When she finally, after many many calls, went out to inspect, the abuser had been tipped off and there was a bag of feed in the barn. The barn that the horses were never in. We got into trouble for throwing some hay to these starving horses whose body scores ranged from 3-5. We had pictures, we had a dead horse, we had proof of everything but thanks to the vet not talking, the police, the humane officer the abuser snuck off in the middle of the night with the horses. Later on the news all those horses were found dead from starvation. She had been doing this for years but the legal system, the humane officers, etc did NOT do their jobs so they are responsible for the horrors seen on the news. This is only one sickening story. The Tucker story is not unique whatsoever.
As I'm sittin' here eating my breakfast of sausage(from a pig) and eggs(probably crated chicken) and washing it down with a big glass of ice cold milk it comes to mind that this group that invaded and decided to "wage war" with one of our own isn't winning the hearts and minds of anyone here in this part of Kansas.
In fact with all the hate speech and sorry sounding sob stories they have probably accomplished the opposite.
PETA
People
Eating
Tasty
Animals.
If there is some big animal hating conspiracy going on, why haven't the many pictures taken by the people complaining on here being circulated around town to make local people aware? Coming on the tribune's online comment section (not a forum btw) doesn't give the public the picture you want to paint. I am a meat eater and an animal lover and I don't believe that makes me a hypocrite.
I do not know much about horses but I do know they require a lot of care. Any animal dumped out in a staggering condition is going to need even more attention. I am not sure that putting out to pasture is the best way to help these horses, but I can understand that many good-hearted people get in over their head trying to help out.
I do not know this Miller and I am no animal rights activist by any means Countery girl. I did however grow up and live most of my life in the country, and have owned lots of horses in my life. Not to mention that I use to train horses for a living. I come from the Flint hills were there are lots of ranches and cowboys. I am a Cowgirl and have done everything you can think of on a ranch from butchering our own chikens, cows, and pigs, to staying up all night with a sick animal. I am appailed that you call your self country girl and have this attitude and I find it very unlikely you will find a cowboy that would agree with you. Cowboys and Cowgirls like me care for their animals like family. Our horses are the most important thing we have and we care for them like you would a child. With holding proper medical care is not something we would indorse or put up with. I have been watching these horses on a daily basis and I know what has been going on out there. Quite frankly I am discusted! I beleive the public should hear and see the truth. The pictures in this artical are not the real ones and there are some pretty graphic real pictures of these horses. I think the pubic should be able to see the real ones and judge for them selves.
Hey Countrygal,
I have found a song for you that is a country song, and is one of my favorites playing on the radio right now.
Here it is, with some of the lyrics.
It pretty much describes life and folk in this area. It is titled, "WAY OUT HERE"
by a new artist named Josh Thompson.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0sYnro_3...
Way out here lyrics
by josh thompson
Our houses are protected by the good Lord and a gun
And you might meet 'em both if you show up here unwelcome son
Our necks are burnt, the roads are dirt and our trucks ain't clean
The dogs run loose, we smoke, we chew and fry everything
Out here, way out here
(Chorus)
We won't take a dime if we ain't earned it
When it comes to weight, brother we pull our own
If it's our backwoods way of living your concerned with
Well you can leave us alone
We're about John Wayne,Johnny Cash and John Deere
Way out here
..
We've got a fightin' side, a mile wide but we pray for peace
Cause it's mostly us that end up serving overseas
If it was up to me I'd love to see this country run
Like it used to be, like it ought to be, just like it's done
Out here, Way out here....
no worries to anti slaughter.. first of all to locals on here defending this is. This is only tip of iceberg. it is not just the TPC group coming in. We are nation wide from many orgs. from equine world. Gov. office even been getting calls. proper channels are to be conducted and will be. Country gal go eat hamburger and get a date. sounds like you are very enthralled with tucker boys and meat. get a hobby and expand your mind outside of that. THere is other things in life other than stuffing your face with red meat and boys.
My grandmother ate horse during the depression. She said it was way too sweet, but she ate it anyway.
my god are what does that have to do with this? who cares the fact is horses are being sold for slaughter our American horses. To Japan, Europe. process for MX. is stabbing over and over in the neck until immobilized. strung up and slit the throat while still alive. then blood is drained out slowly. Now ask yourself is this a horses lover that would ship a horse to that fate???? There is no depression and we it is illegal to eat horse in this country. it is not illegal to ship over the border. THe issue is the treatment before they go. If their fate is this then why not at least try to make it as comfortable before hand??? THe solution is to get more co sponsors to support H.R. 503!http://www.habitatforhorses.org/joincampaigns/ahspa.html
>>stabbing over and over in the neck until immobilized.
I'd hazard a guess that whoever you are accusing of doing this needs to study anatomy, use a butchers meat chart and get a sharper knife.
>>stuffing your face with red meat......
I like mine medium rare....preferably seared on a charcoal grill.
Could have bet this would be the findings on this case. I got angry too. There's nothing wrong with being angry, the Bible says, however, to not let the sun to go down upon your wrath." ( Ephesians 4:26 ). Use your anger differently. Write letters to the local law enforcement, county attorney Reps, Senators, Governor,PETA. Most of all Pray! Don't tell God how big your problem is, tell your problem how big your God is!
"Lightening" you have some serious issues. Do you not have a life. You made your point and nobody cares. All you have achieved is proving you are nothing more than a bored immature hateful ignorant with nothing better to do than to try and cause trouble. You either missed your dose of meds or are in serious need of some. You were right, the troll is out and by looking at everyone else's comments meat eaters or not you seem to be the ONLY troll on here. You are in desperate need of some help and in serious need of a brain enema. This is a very serious issue that you obviously have no idea about and have no right to spew your juvenile poison in the midst of intelligent conversation between those who actually care. Crawl back into your hole please and leave this alone.
DO NOT FEED LIGHTENING! WE HAVE MORE IMPORTANT THINGS TO SPEND OUR ENERGY ON.
>>serious issues..
When its needed.
>>have a life.....
Retired, don't owe a nickle to no one,do what I want/when I want and with who I want, have kids and grandkids,one who has posted in this topic.
>>missed your dose....
If a person eats proper they don't require much meds,
>>brain enema...
I've heard a coffee enema is quite relaxing.
>>intelligent conversation...
Haven't seen much of that here from the non local contributor's.
>>DO NOT FEED LIGHTN....
Practice what you preach.
Also went on a 100 motorcycle mile ride this morning, when I got home I mowed my 5 acre yard.
Fixed a flat on my truck, fed the critters and ran to town to get a late lunch and drove by Tuckers horse facility and from what I saw the horses looked quite healthy better than most cattle operations in this area and still have time to reply to your personal attack on me and its just 4:55.
So Rhiannon what have you done today that was so constructive?
Everybody has there own opinion..So Rhiannon why are you critizising what everybody puts? And what is Tucker suppose to do when he gets the horses that already look like that? It does not take a day to fatten them up..
Hey Chiripada,
what do you have to say about this hypocrisy?
Finally, there are some people out there doing undercover video's of animal sanctuaries and rescue facilities, and the discovery is shocking treatment,neglect and abuse of animals by the supposed animal advocates themselves!!!
Here is a link to a video of a "horse rescue sanctuary" funded to the tune of 3.5 million dollars by private donations just a few years ago. This rescue site sits on 1120 acres of land. The conditions in the video could be described according to you and your friends standards as deplorable,inhumane,cruel and abusive, but I'm betting you will find a way to attempt to defend this complete hypocrisy.
Here is the link for everyone to see;
http://humanewatch.org/index.php/site/po...
Jej, I posted in the beginning my thoughts about what was happening. I did not expect to get such immature responses from those who havent a clue what is happening to these horses. They sit and read the paper and believe everything their home town media has to say. I have seen the photos and the horses are NOT brought to the Tuckers for rehab or vetting. That is NOT what the tuckers do. I am not criticizing, I am replying to ridiculous remarks. Take a look back at everything else that has been written. The only two I took issue with were the ones that have no business being here talking their trash. This is supposed to be an intelligent conversation yet we see two on here that have done nothing but make fools of themselves. I see others who I dont particularly agree with but I say nothing because what they say has meaning. They are not out here acting like little teenager trolls. You are correct jej, everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Read back to lightening and country gals remarks. What does loving cowboys and stuffing your face with meat have to do with the Tucker situation? Thank you for your reply.
Lightening, your question does NOT deserve an answer. I couldnt care less what you did or do. What I do to make the animals safer is the business of ara's and mature people who actually care about the state of the animals. I do not owe you any explanation. You are foul and belong somewhere else. Read over everything you wrote here and tell me that any decent person would tell you a blessed thing about themselves. Anti Slaughter, I couldn't agree more. Thank you for your mature and intelligent conversation on this topic!!!!!
Rhiannon while you are not caring about cowboys, burgers and what lightening spent his day doing, what are you doing? Specifically what are you personally doing to make this situation or any other better? How do you know that every person on here doesn't have some connection to something to better the lives of critters in this area or elsewhere? Maybe some of the other posters on here would like to know what agencies or organizations they should be a part of to be able to come on here and be so insightful.
Rhiannon, its "Lightning" not Lightening(no such word), install spellchecker or get a dictionary.
You seem to care enough to reply to my post thinking you can sway the locals thinking.
NOT going to happen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
staceya,
Here is a website that I recommend you visit that will help you gain some insight as to what the animals rights fanatics and organizations say they do, and what they actually do.
http://humanewatch.org/
There are many links to articles that expose the hypocrisy, greed and uterior motives that drive these marketing for money machines.
PS, my cowboy and I enjoyed a fine dinner last night at the Hereford House.
Au revoir
>>fine dinner at the Herford........
DROOL.... quit your teasing....thats making me hungry!! for some RED MEAT MEDIUM RARE!!
Countrygal, I also had some rare steak last night and it was very good. I see nothing wrong with eating meat or butchering and animal for food. I am an avid hunter but I always eat what I kill. I also see nothing wrong with putting a suffering animal down and have had to do just that a few times my self. As I said before I am no animal rights activist, I am more concerned with the treatment of an animal while they are alive, weather the are headed for slaughter or not. I did watch the video you suggested and I found nothing wrong with the living conditions in it or out at the Tucker's. The horses in the video were healthy with no injuries and had been well fed. I have never said I thought the living conditions out on the Tucker's farm were bad either, or that they were not feeding these horses. These horses have plenty to eat, they are so skinny because they have not been wormed properly and the cuts and injuries on them had no signs of medical care at all. A horse that is severely infested with worms will not respond to cheap de-wormer. If they are treated with a good de-wormer they will start to improve on good grass after a couple of weeks. These horses (who are on good grass) were and are still not showing any signs of improvement. The injuries (cuts & abrasions) are still not being cared for. I have always given my cattle the best medical attention even when the were due to go to the slaughter house in a few days. The killing of an animal is not inhumane its the neglect of care and treatment while they are still alive that causes them to suffer inhumanely. I am not saying that I agree with the way they kill in Mexico, because there are much more humane ways of killing than how they do it down there, but Mexico slaughter houses really wasn't the issue here. I would just like to see these horses get the proper medical care they need and start to see them return to healthy & happy existence soon.
chiripada,
Did you have a veterinarian with you when you examined these horses?
Kansas Statues regarding animal neglect - it is almost impossible to get them enforced but, here they are anyway: http://www.animallaw.info/statutes/stusk...
FIRST..Tucker's buy horses for sale to slaughter.. slaughter horses are Livestock met to go for food for people.. They can not have med's or worming.. for 6 months before slaughter.. When the Tucker's buy the horse from the sale barn.. I am sure there are many thin.. cut up horses.. NOT TUCKER'S FALT... He puts them on green grass.. Good feed... and that is all he can do.. no wormer.. no med's.. just feed.. You ABR's and FOB's are the ones that helped push this.. you knew it would happen.. LIVE WITH IT... and a horse that has a score of 4 or 5 is a horse that is good shape.. 1 and 2 are very thin... 3 is a horse that has a outline of ribs.. (like a race horse has).. so lay off the Tucker's.. They are just doing what "YOU" have made sure is a law that will be upheld...
As for the picture.. if that person was close enough to take the picture then how come there is no close up's of the so called bones... ya that is what I thought too... THERE AINT ANY..
I would believe Michael Pommier's photographs over some "anonymous source" anyday of the week!!!
I would also believe the findings of the STATE Veterinarian over the allegations Jason Miller, a self-described "anarcho-veganist" who states on his front page the anarchist symbol represents among other things,democracy.
When I look up the word anarchist here is what I find,"Anarchist" --noun
1. a person who advocates or believes in anarchy or anarchism.
2. a person who seeks to overturn by violence all constituted forms and institutions of society and government, with no purpose of establishing any other system of order in the place of that destroyed.
3. a person who promotes disorder or excites revolt against any established rule, law, or custom.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/a...